All-Community
Discussion: tool storage
Proposal File: proposals/prp-use2008-12-14dbl-digit room.pdf
All-Community
Decisions: allow Crown fourplex to build fences
Discussion: Crown fences
Proposal: Crown fence
Proposal File: proposals/prp2008-10-12crown fencing.pdf
All-Community
Decisions:
Topics:
All-Community
Decisions:
Topics:
All-Community
ACM June 7 2008
Discussion: lights, thieves & vandals
All-Community
Saturday, April 12
Decisions: ACM schedule to alternate 2nd Sunday and 2nd Wednesday each month; remove Right of First Refusal
Topics: Discussion: ACM Day Question: Shall we continue to meet on the second Saturday at the same times or shall we meet Sunday afternoons? Goal: Decide on a regular weekend meeting time.
Discussion: Committee Meetings. Rain gutters, CH lawn: houses for rent/sale, ACM schedule, CC&R Right of First Refusal/FHA Loans:
Proposal: ACM schedule, remove CCR right of first refusal
All-Community
Decisions:
Topics:
All-Community
ACM minutes
All-Community
ACM Minutes 2-23-08
All-Community
ACM
annual
Decisions:
Topics:
Management is having the Rain Gutter Specialists come out to put gutter toppers on some units (those with lots of trees, can't do with a step ladder) and it'll cost $5,200 with the discount they got. It will be using some of the unused money previously budgeted for committees that has not yet been spent.
Celebrations committee is having a party on the 13th of December to celebrate the many Sagittarius' in the community, and welcome all of the new folks here.
Some would like to see dining club happening, possibly a monthly brunch or a co-op order share that we turn into a big meal?
Some would like to have an ad hock emergency preparedness committee form to investigate a generator, plan, water, basics. Also (possibly separate group) to investigate making the community more self sufficient
Parents committee has been discussing the purchase of an air hockey table, possibly in the upstairs area that is mostly unused.
Core committees are Welcoming, Management, Work and Process
Standing committees are maintenance, parents, landscape, celebrations, safety crown, common-house furnishings
There was an idea that "common house furnishings" should change to "common house operations"
Dining and gardening are clubs. Don't get budget from community and don't count as "work" toward participation agreements. Though, some communities do require dining, but that gets set up before move-in.
Some might like to see a social architect/mediation committee, and others.
Another meeting will dedicate more time to the topic of committees.
Tool Storage Discussion: A discussion to address concerns and hear ideas about the workshop/garage and tool storage generally.
The discussion was presented as a model, so the community can practice our process and get used to the way it should work, but also because we do have lots of stuff in the garage and may want to address this situation if there is interest from the community.
To review, the steps in our process are:
Problem: there is no room in the garage. You could not pull a car in there to work on it.
Mary's welder can't be used when there is gas and flammables in there. To be more self sufficient we should be able to use our amenities.The discussion entailed the possibility of a shed, or two sheds (one on each side of the property), what should be prioritized as important use of space.
Ad Hoc committee: Nancy, George, Kay, Kevin, Myste, Mike A, Lynda (with George as "convenor") to investigate needs, money, permits, etc.
Hi all,
The ACM minutes from November 12 are attached, and also pasted below. Sorry they didn't go out any sooner but I hadn't planned on taking notes (so didn't write it down in my brain, I mean my book ;) ) and completely forgot about it after the ACM... then at parents meeting yesterday it hit me!
Hope I captured everything in these...
Amy
Naomi: A hard freeze prodicted for tomorrow night, disconnect outside hoses and turn off outside faucets. (Kay will do this for garden and orchard)
Nancy: Tomorrow, Monday, 6:15 pm meet in Sukkah building, then at 6:30 vegetarian potluck in CH. During the whole week Nancy will be for dinner in the Sukkah building at 6 pm, everybody invited to join her.
Linda: feel free to harvest all vegetables in my beds (counting from the West the north-south facing beds 2 and 3)
Kay: ditto with my beds (with fence panel, 5th over from Ackerman)
Shall we do something for Thanksgiving? Many will be out of town, but those who envision being here should plan something.
George: all committees should send very basic notes to the mailing list, with 4 points:
Rebekka: next ACM we will go in more detail through the proposal development process as discussed in our last retreat. The first step is not the formulation of a proposal but first the issue should be presented which needs to be resolved. Then, with the feedback from the discussion of the issue, the proposal should be formulated. Goal is to write only proposals which will be consensed. This procedure is good for difficult proposals, may not be necessary in every case.
A list was made which identified the units not represented in the meeting today. People could sign up to volunteer talking to those not in attendance to keep them informed. It is better for the community if everybody is informed, and if we reach out personally instead of just sending out the email Minutes.
Height is 6 feet, with the upper two feet forming a comb which can be partly seen through. Material is trex, made from recycled wood and recycled plastic the same material many have now on their balconies.
After a long discussion, and extension of the meeting more than 30 minutes the proposal was consensed as passed. Four stand asides and one abstention: Stand-asides: Hob, Isabella, Nancy, Rebecca. Abstain: Naomi. Mike P was not present but he said he would stand aside with the proposal as given.
Attached and pasted below are the minutes from the 9/10 ACM. Please acknowledge omissions or additions you notice. Note that the discussion about what works/what's tough/what would make things better can continue on email.
Heather
Fruit is ripe in the orchard, please pick!
New Neighbor: Lydia has purchased #13 and will be moving in this weekend if all goes well. Welcome, Lydia!!!
Saturday, September 13: Benefit for SPLORE: Harvest Moon Benefit Auction; Hilton Salt Lake Center; doors open at 6:00, Auction from 7:30 to 10:00 pm; $65 per person. See Hob for more details.
Sunday, September 14: Questioning Minds Lecture Series at the Main Library, 2:00 pm. Guest Speaker: Rocky Anderson, topic: human rights violations around the world. See the Angelastros for more info.
Friday, September 26: Community Dance in the Common House with live music! (I believe the time was 7 pm, correct me if I?m wrong?hlh)
Saturday, September 27: Jobs with Justice Benefit Memorial for Utah Phillips at the University of Utah. Hans will post more information about time and place.
Swamp Coolers: Important to shut down the swamp coolers before the first freeze. Mike Wason has posted a sign-up sheet in the mailroom for those who would like him to service your cooler. Prices have risen due to the necessity for increased maintenance and parts. Opening & centering exercise focusing on what each individual wants to give to the community. Check-in
Committee Reports (committee members listed) Management: Kay (President), Mike P., Mike W., Anne, Linda Reed, Steve H.
HOA reinstated after lapse in payment, thanks to Linda Reed. Process: Rebecca, Michelle, George, Linda R., Nancy
New committee is working on tracking minutes & decisions. They have been looking for minutes that have been archived. Kay will look for binder with archived minutes.
The CROWN committee requested that the amended fence proposal be scheduled for October?s meeting.
Process committee will work to clarify consensus practice. There is confusion about whether amendments to proposals need to be resubmitted and distributed in advance of the ACM.
Process also will work on charting needs of the community.
Will meet 2x a month on Thursdays, specifics TBA. Parents: Bea (chair) and all parents
All parents were represented at the last meeting in which the kids talked about what they liked about the community and made requests at the beginning of the meeting. Paul requested work on the bike jump, which came to fruition through Trent?s organization of the bike jump work party last Saturday. Genny requested more community-wide social gatherings and the committee is organizing some fun activities like bowling.
Victor established a regular September Saturday movie night for the kids. Younger kids will watch from 5 to 7 pm and the older kids from 7-9.
Play structure in the north field will be discussed at the next Parents? meeting. Kevin fixed the immediate hazard.
Trampoline will not work at Wasatch Commons.
Parents will discuss the email list at the next meeting. Work Support: Michelle (chair) and all work team leaders
The work list has been finalized. Welcoming/Orientation: Vicky (chair), Hob, Joanne
Thanks to Hob who listed Wasatch Commons with IC.org, through which Lydia found us.
All homes are full.
Joanne and Vicky tabled for Cohousing at the American Muslim Assoc. Festival. Very poorly attended.
Tour Saturday at 1:00 p.m. Hans gave a tour this past week.
Still lots of interest in Wasatch Commons; Vicky receives many calls.
Review of Consensus Please see documents distributed by Rebecca prior to the meeting. Michelle facilitated a general discussion about consensus practice based on three documents, ?The Formal Consensus Process? chart, ?Ground Rules for Meetings??, and a summary of Quaker guidelines for Meeting for Business. Michelle reviewed the chart and read the Quaker guidelines. Discussion briefly summarized: Blocks occur when a proposal has not been fully vetted. Vivian noted that everyone needs to read and understand a proposal before discussion. Blocks are meant ONLY for decisions an individual feels would harm the entire community, not for matters of personal preference. Lydia quoted Carolyn Estes who suggests that we should consider that a person has one block in a lifetime. While consensus takes time, decisions made through consensus ultimately save time. Linda R. noted that Mike P. and the original cohousers built this place through consensus. Rebecca highlighted four ground rules (see handout): 2. The group?s well-being is paramount. 7. Relinquish ownership of ideas. 8. Conflict is desirable. 9. Everyone is responsible to know the process. Process works if all cohousers remember that we are here for a purpose, bigger than our self-interest. We need to trust that we are all here in good faith. We then discussed the process in three parts: ?what works?, ?what makes it tough?, and ?what would make it work better?.
Everybody?s voice gets heard
Copies of proposals distributed prior to the meeting
People show up
Unique ideas emerge through discussion
People tend to listen with their hearts
Quality of discussion is better through consensus
We work better collectively than individually?better ideas come from discussion
One monthly meeting ?has effects??seems to focus group on upcoming meeting
Committees function best when empowered and trusted to work in good faith
Efficient and lasting decisions when everyone?s on board
When data is distributed prior to a meeting, our proposal format works well to cover all data.
Detached facilitation works better than invested facilitation.
When discussions take place at one meeting and get carried over to the next, discussion get repeated because people missed the first discussion. Concerns that were already addressed reemerge.
Discussion threads are lost meeting to meeting.
Annual or more frequent consensus updates/reviews are necessary
Process Committee burnout
Community well-being depends on individual well-being?sometimes something that ?works? for the whole community yet affects one individual too negatively can be ultimately negative for the whole community.
Too much work for too few
Lack of goodwill
Not all data in before discussion.
What Makes it Work Better
Attendance at meetings
Non-attendees could be approached individually after the meeting about important issues/events that were discussed
ACM agendas posted on the white board
Meeting ended with agreement that this discussion can continue via email.
Work teams, work for money update, plan for areas already weeded, renters status of houses, crafts room, revisit ACM day.
July and Aug are covered, with the other teams there may still be changes. Michele will work on it when she gets back. You should expect another work team list on your doors. Please check if you are ok with your present assignment.
700 left in the fund.
Hans' matching offer is still good.
Hob has rommate Bruce. Fine art photographer. His car got broken into today. Every time there is a new car it is broken into. Someone is watching us.
Cousin's house: Relocation company bought the house, apparently sold it now to Prudential. Linda R. received a letter asking where to send the condo fees.
Nancy and Michele have been watering their yard.
Management should contact the owner. Do they kow about the special character of our community? The CC&R's does not say anything about our work requirements, consensus, etc.
We need to be in contact with the realtor who is representing the home. Send them information. We need to be proactive. Management will give info to the realtor. Put our info into he buiding.
Be prepared to resistance to this informaion.
As an aside: Manageent should publish minutes and agendas.
Heather: it has been a one-person committee, she wants to step down.
Process is responsible for overseeing relationships and making sure ACMs happen. Discussion weighted down with the schisms in the community.
Nancy, Laraine, George, Rebecca are on new process committee, with Heather, Joanne, Michele as adjuncts facilitators.
ACM dates were discussed. Shall we move from Sunday back to Saturday? No change was made but it may be revisited later. Lynda: 2nd Sunday in month is Questioning Minds Sunday.
What to do with the weeds that are coming back. Naomi was set to continue spraying.
Who is in charge of the drip watering system in the West area? Mike A does lawn sprinklers but berms on West side are not his responsibility. Somebody has to take on the drip systems. Amy D worked with the guy who put them in, but she is not doing it now.
The water is on, Kay knows how to program the drip system. Naomi will take reponsibility of drip system, Kay will show her how to program it.
Laraine: some sprinkler heads in Isabella's area are gushing every morning, overwatering the plants. If we woodchip, put cardboard under the chips, much better than weed barrier.
George: laissez faire approach to managing common property is inefficient. The whole is too much but if we break it up into smaller chunks this would be much more efficient.
Why not have one sprinkler systm and mow it all at once.
Some people like doing a garden area around their unit, they should do their own garden, other should be allowed to opt out.
Some day we need a real discussion about taking care of common property. We need a more holistic approach how we are doing this.
Our paid weeders should do the ara around the cousins, weeds in front of their house.
Mike A can get the CH lawn by this weekend.
Ann would like to clear out the craftsroom, have paint and materials available and do something with the children. But now the room is used as storage area. Mike P has stuff in there. Air filters and other maintenance items for CH in there too. Other storage places? Filled with Christmas decorations.
Declare a workparty. Put the dates of the clearing-out work party on the internet.
Genny's 16th birthday celebration Friday 13h, potato bar, 6 pm
Hob needs sponsors for MS bike ride.
Vicky needs ride to airport 11 am Wednesday Nancy is coming in at same time.
Van is stickshift.
Vicky still needs a suitcase.
Victor: Would like to organize a campout for kids next weekend.
Linda P: Jobs with Justice has pledge drive the next week: June 10-16, Please donate. htp://wwww.utahjwj.org
Have been discussing fixing the pole lights, rekeying, keep up with payments etc.
Orientation meeting was last Friday.
Vicky will leave welcoming materials with Hob.
If aybody every calls or comes by, make sure you get their address, phone number and/or email.
One tiller was fixed, the other tiller was beyond repair, but Steve H wants it.
Landscapig removed two of the dangerous leaning trees over Nancy's and Adrienne's unit.
Mary: will fix them with a very stable ladder. Hans has agreed to help, need perhaps 1 more person to move the heavy ladder. Also spray it with black woodstove spraypaint. Mary is going to get the bulbs.
Has list of lights that are off or intermittent.
Light pole south of Crown: wiring is broken, we cannot do it.
Hob could do it Sunday. Carol, Kay. Hans, Mary. Talk about it at party Friday at 6 pm.
First discussions were not about landsaping but about work-or-pay option.
Then Naomi put out proposal mandating that everybody put in a certain amount.
This was changed into voluntary. We received $2200 and a pledge of another 260 forthcoming.
Majority has been spent on labor: West berm, by overflow basin in CH, and across from Naomi, Kevin.
We didn't get the right kind of woodchips, made the best from this mixup. Use the woodchips, the community paid for them.
We spent about 1700 so far.
Hob: morphed from work for pay to weeding committee. I was hoping a work for pay decision would come out of this.
Joanne: many more weeding jobs, hopes to hire him at least for the rest of this moth, would have enough work for the whole Summer but not enough money.
Naomi and Mary has been weeding west berm, and spraying with If you work up there do not remove the mulches against the plants, they are there deliberately.
There was some uncertainty whether we have to put in curb and gutter. Van Turner seems to thinks so, but Hob said that we would have had to post a bond had that been a city requirement. City may put it in themselves and then assess us for it. feedback from ad hoc: don't want the ad hoc committee to stop.
Mary we have never paid for woodchips before, she has always been organizing for free woodchips.
Hans: will we have a much higher condo fee next year?
There is also the motion by Linda R. that there should be no required work.
Mary: we never had a time budget, after hiring help this year we will have some idea about the required time.
We would like to know everybody's intetions around work or money?
This is not a new request; last ACM had asked to respond by June 1st.
Make the forms available where people can fill out their work plans.
Amy H. will send out an email.
How can we make the place safer?
Beg May: several kids came through property, one took Paul's bicycle, we (Kevin?) apprehended idividual by 17th south and canal.
2 hours later some people interested in cohousing were visiting Hob. When they went out to the car to leave, glass of the driver's side had been smashed in ipod was stolen. Around the same time, Isabella saw 3 kids running off the property.
Amy H: 5 kids tried to steal the bicycles. Reported to the police. 2 hours
later they came back to play basketball, police came and escorted them home.
Last weekend when returning from 3 day river trip Mary discovered that these same kids had vandalized her garden area: smashed trellis, uprooted plants cut hoses. Nancy saw them, one was involved in bike theft. They were just 8-12 years old
Amy D. has a video of some of the kids. If they are on our property, take pictures of them.
Several cars were broken into: Vivian, Michael's girlfried Connie, Ann, Becky, Trent.
Nothing was taken except Connie's radio.
Thursday morning: large group of youg males, early teens, in school clothes came off Utah, started runing through here. Kevin told them to go around, but when Kevin turned his back they ran through the central path. Kevin followed them until school, talked to police about it.
If ay of these kids had family members that are not in the country legally they may see themselves in a very vulnerable position.
Nancy was in community garden. they came in two times to check out the place and then rode by the entrance and looked if Nancy was still there.
Carol: turn the lights on.
Alley access is problematical.
Need a new gate at alley. Discussion whether community should buy a gate that is wide enough; no decision.
West side North end is another area of easy access. Get a short fence to stop that access?
Kay ordered Private drive sign for long East drive, so that people cannot say they thought this was a street.
Put a car alarm in, this will discourage them from going from one car to the next. Cameras are an option. Shall we use the whistles again? Idea of a log is a great idea. Cannot rely on police to do much.
There seem to be two kinds of vandals: o Young kids stealing bikes. o Older kids stealing car stereo or ipod, travelling by car
Usually someone discovers us and thinks it is an easy target; after we apprehend them, it stops.
These minutes are from memory... please feel free to add, change, delete anything....
Discussion of Committees that will be using the hour time slot to meet before ACM. Note that all are expected to attend this first hour of each Weekend ACM (6 x per year):
All of the above is subject to revision.
CORE committees: Management Process Work Support Orientation
Discussion to change ACM day/time from Saturday to Sunday: Passed. Our new day/time is the 2nd Sunday (every other month) from 2-5pm. This will start in June and the time will not change as it did before in summer. We will be alternating with the 2nd Wednesday of each month:
Hob Question: Shall we amend the Declaration and Bylaws of Wasatch Commons to eliminate the Right of First Refusal ( b, c, & d of Article XIII, ?Changes in Unit Ownership?Right of First Refusal?) in recognition of the growing importance of FHA mortgages? Goal: 75% of owners must sign a motion to amend the bylaws.
Proposal to change declaration and bylaws to omit the Association's "Right of First Refusal". Passed.
M & M Gutters came out for an estimate. The estimate is $1,090. This includes gutter covers for three sides of the workshop, and Units 8,24,25,26, and a new gutter/downspout for the backside of the workshop and gutter clean out for all of the above. Questions were asked about gutter screens vs. gutter covers and checking on Unit 17 which has a broken gutter. Also, the estimate seemed high to some. Amy H. will contact them to get questions asked and get a new estimate that covers workshop (minus the new gutter which some feel is not needed on backside) and Unit 17. If you would like to meet with M & M Gutters along with Amy, please let her know ASAP so she can schedule it.
Mary Has contacted the lawn sprinkling system company, who should be checking the lawn within the next few weeks. She and Mike A. will report back at May's meeting.
On Monday, April 07, 2008 4:32 PM wacoho on behalf of Hobson Calhoun wrote:
Subject: [WaCoHo] A sneak preview from Hob
Attachments: A MOTION to eliminate Right of First Refusal
We need the signatures of at least 3/4 of the unit owners to make a small, but very important, change to our Association declarations. This change should allow new residence to take advantage of the new improved FHA loan programs, so I am hoping most of you will attend this ACM this Saturday which starts at 10 am.
To make the reason for the need for the change clear, and perhaps save some time on Saturday (gardens and yards are awaiting!), it was suggested to me that I send out the actual proposal in advance of our Saturday get-together. Please find it attached.
Please call or email me if there is anything unclear about what the Management Committee is trying to accomplish (I have been asked by Management to prepare this proposal). I will also include the proposal in the body of this email, just in case...
A MOTION brought to the April 12, 2008 All Community Meeting by the Management Committee of Wasatch Commons Condominium Association:
Whereas we, the undersigned unit owners in Wasatch Commons Condominiums, recognize the growing importance of FHA mortgages in our changing real estate credit environment, especially for young families and first-time home buyers;
And whereas, this provision allows the Association (us) to purchase a unit ahead of anyone else, but was put in place because of uncertainty regarding initial sales of units,
And whereas, the provision has never been used and hurts our chances of getting FHA approval;
We, the undersigned, hereby approve of a change in the Declaration and Bylaws of Wasatch Commons Condominiums recorded with Salt Lake County on October 2, 1998 which will eliminate the Association's Right of First Refusal
Specifically, we approve the deletions of sections b), c), and d) of Article XIII titled "Changes in Unit Ownership Right Refusal", and change the title of Article XIII to read "Changes in Unit Ownership".
On Monday, April 07, 2008 2:51 PM WaCoHo on behalf of Heather Hirschi wrote:
:Subject:[WaCoHo] ACM agenda (announcement #2). Attachments:acm.agenda.04.12.08.doc;
Saturday, April 12 9:00 am to 12:00 pm Meeting begins promptly - please arrive on time
Agenda 9:00 to 9:20.
jFacilitator: Heather
Notetaker: Amy Hyde
Refreshments and Check-in 9:20 to 9:40
Schedule 9:40 to 10:20
Committee Meetings 10:20 to 10:30
Committee Reports 10:30 to 10:55
Progress Reports
Rain gutters: Amy H.
CH lawn: Mary
Houses for rent/sale at Wasatch Commons: Hob, Becky & Trent, Steve, Brian & Stirling
10:55 to 11:25
Discussion: ACM Day Question: Shall we continue to meet on the second Saturday at the same times or shall we meet Sunday afternoons (12-3:00 pm)? Goal: Decide on a regular weekend meeting time.
11:25 to 11:55
Discussion: Right of First Refusal/FHA Loans. Hob Question: Shall we amend the Declaration and Bylaws of Wasatch Commons to eliminate the Right of First Refusal ( b, c, & d of Article XIII, ?Changes in Unit Ownership?Right of First Refusal?) in recognition of the growing importance of FHA mortgages? Goal: 75% of owners must sign a motion to amend the bylaws.
11:55 to 12:00
Evaluation/Check-out
Amy H. will report on the rain gutters on April12.
Garden group met Sunday. Timers on water lines, and sunken beds are strongly encouraged but not required. Request for compost to be purchased from landscape budget, they will find straw for mulch. Not sure if there are enough beds for everyone.
Where does the water master and lawn issue stand? Mike A.: Mows the lawn, enjoys looking at a healthy lawn after it's done. If it looks dead in areas his enthusiasm dwindles. Problem seems to be uneven watering system. There may be a leak in front of the CH. Mike's objective is that the lawn be [at least] minimally attractive and use the least amount of water. Mary: Has settled on a company that will work on our system. This is the same company that worked on the orchard, B&D Landscaping. They will reassess the entire system. They will likely be here the first part of May.
Mary will schedule and report back 4-12-08. Mike wants to be involved in any re-design of the system. Mary will let him know when the company will come.
A product called Wow will be used on the lawn. This product will impede weed growth. Mike A. will spread it on the lawn this spring.
Water report: Linda Reed, Linda brought comparisons for past 3 years of water use. They are posted in the internal mail room.
Next Meeting Progress reports: Water Masters, CH Lawn, Amy H. Rain gutters.
: The proposal was read by Heather. It essentially says process is proposing a monthly meeting to alternate Saturdays and Wednesdays, in place of the twice monthly meetings. Various comments were made: Nancy: Would rather keep it at 2 a month Linda: We should try something new. Change is good!
Heather: We only had 10 people last time; no one realizes the time spent in preparation. I spent about 10 this week hours including writing a proposal; this is a lot of time for process. Vaughn: Tired of coming to ACMs and repeating the same things. Mike A. No decision we make tonight is permanent.
Vicky: likes the idea of committee meetings on the same Sat as ACM although, she is sorry not to have 2 meetings, because of her work schedule cannot attend Saturdays.
Carol: Has to work Saturday and cannot attend on Saturdays. Decisions should be made with those who do attend.
Mary: This could drag out our decision making process. What takes 3 meetings now could take 3 months.
Heather: That's why extra meeting times are built into the proposal. Mike A. We can communicate by e-mail.
Mary: not always the best plan to do communication by e-mail. Kevin: There will be more pressure to use the meeting for decision making, less time for relationship building.
George: This will not guarantee more people coming, is the idea to get more people, or is it just too much work for process.
More comments I didn't get, please write them in if you made a comment significantly different from what is here.. There were suggestions of other days such as Sunday afternoons.
We took a vote [called for consensus]. The one meeting a month was passed with 5 stand asides, no blocks.
We will discuss possibilities of other times such as Sunday at next months meeting on 4-12-08 Now that we are going to one meeting a month, it is important that community members prioritize community meetings and put the dates on their calendars. The next meeting will be Saturday April 12 at 9:00 AM this will allow for committees to meet beforehand. If you are heading a committee please contact your members. At that time we will discuss alternate days that could work better for members.
Make any corrections to the notes.
Thanks, Joanne
On Monday, April 07, 2008 1:55 PM wacoho on behalf of Heather Hirschi wrote:
Subject: [WaCoHo] ACM announcement #1 PLEASE READ.
ACM Schedule
At the last All Community Meeting (ACM), we consensed to meet once instead of twice monthly. According to this new schedule, monthly meetings will alternate between the second Weekend Day (see ACM agenda item: ACM Saturday or Sunday?) and the second Wednesday of each month (see calendar below).
The Weekend meetings, beginning with the next ACM on Saturday, April 12 (see agenda), will start at 9:00 am. The first hour of the Weekend ACM's will be given to committee meetings. Not all committees will meet during this hour, particularly those (like Management) that already have regularly scheduled meeting times.
At the April 12 ACM, we will use the first hour, from 9 to 10, to establish which committees will meet during the ACM hour. We will use the sign up sheet posted in the CH laundry room hallway as a starting point for this discussion. For example, according to the sign-up sheet, Common House Furnishings and Landscaping committees have overlapping members. However, all three CH Furn.'s participate on Landscaping committee. There are a number of additional Landscaping members. Since more people are on landscaping, it might make more sense for Landscaping to use the ACM hour than for CH Furn. to use it as it easier to coordinate three people's schedules for the alternative meeting.
We hope to make these decisions quickly so we can use the remainder of the hour for committees to meet and discuss their protocol.
Please sign up for 1-2 committees BEFORE April 12.
Egg coloring Sat. March 22 2pm.
Egg hunt Sun March 23 10am (parents needed to help, see Lynda A.) O.C. art stroll Fri. April 18, 5 coho kids have art on display Community hike to
Timpanogas cave June 7. organized and sponsored by parents committee, Amy H. Wacoho Kids paid for by Wacoho. adults 7$. other kids 3$. also $3 entry per car:. we will carpool.
Community dance Fri. March 28 in common house. this will be the last dance of the season. Irish theme. please come and also help out.
Earth Jam. see Vicky. in Liberty Park. if you want to man a Wacoho table see Vicky. Event April 26-27 in Liberty park.
Planning meeting April 19 7-830pm at library downtown.
Replacement needed for Mike W. on management June 9-Aug. 15, they are going to Chile.
Joanne and Vaughn are getting chickens probably on Monday. Hob will keep the baby chicks in his bathroom.
We divided the list generated at last ACM into urgent/necessary/future projects. We also added some suggestions from Mike A. to the list, suggestions that he had put out on email.
Photocopied list (available in CH?) has 14 items generated at last ACM.
15. re. swampiness: problem is in sprinkler system design. in order to adequately water one section you have to overwater another section. possible solution: redesign system.
16. because swampiness only started last year, it is highly likely that there is a leak under the CH lawn somewhere.
Next we examined the items classified as urgent and formulated specific action steps as follows.
1. Mike A. will take on both of these projects (sprinkler system design problem and probable leak) and will work with Amy H. to coordinate help if we need to hire out. Mike A. and Amy H. will confer with landscape committee re. the amount of $ already set aside for this project, and will report back at the next ACM on Wed. March 26.
Decision #2A. The community will empower 2 or 3 Water Masters to oversee water use and report often. One will be from landscape committee and 1 or 2 not.
Mike A. will be one of the non landscape committee Water Masters. By the next
ACM on Wed. March 26, landscape committee will choose their rep to serve as
Water Master. It was noted that Amy D. will be a good resource.
Decision #2B. Mike A. and Kay will write a job description of Water Master's duties by the next ACM on Wed. March 26.
Decision #3: Rain gutter covers. Gutter Toppers will visit community Thursday.
Amy H. will obtain an estimate from them of the cost of covering ALL the uncovered gutters. She will consult with George as needed. She will also obtain a per foot estimate if possible. Amy H. will report back at the next
ACM Wed.
March 26 re. this estimate.
(side note: suggestion: start with higher gutters that are less accessible to us by ladder (Laraine). reasons for gutter covers: so you don't have to clean gutters. they get plugged. exterior of buildings is community property and is getting ruined in several places by rain water running down. also will make it more possible to collect rainwater for gardens and lawns)
Decision #5: Heather will ask Linda R. as treasurer to report once a month at
ACM on water usage in dollars/gallons, specifically this year vs. last year.
March 08 as compared to March 07, etc.
Next we tackled the items on the list that we classified as necessary (but not urgent).
Water Barrels at individual units/underground cistern in orchard: needs a feasability analysis. Hob and Kevin D. are rumored to have info.
George: food coop has similar project going now, maybe we can coordinate with them somehow.
Heather: Maybe we can hook up with engineering/planning/environmental students at U.
Grey water: feasibility study needed.
Several items from the water discussion were placed in the Storage Bin:
Next we moved on to a more informal discussion about how committees and process are working now.
Heather: Process is considering going to 1 ACM a month. Reasons: low attendance. Only 3 people on Process for the last 2 years, too much work planning 2 meetings a month. Other reasons.
Mike A: Main obstacle to attendance is work. Saturdays are better.
Proposal would alternate Wed/Sat each month.
Laraine: It would help continuity, productivity, if minutes from the last meeting were read at the next meeting.
Isabella: That is a standard practice in Roberts Rules. I can do that next meeting. Do you want me to?
Others: yes.
Someone: also would be useful to print them out and have a written record.
Is: I can do that as well. Will start a new binder for this purpose.
Is, can you come to process meeting as well, we need that info because it includes storage bin items.
Is: yes.
We will review committees and who had signed up for what.
Heather: frustrating to be on Process. People want to get something done at ACMs but don't take responsiblity/show up. Also Process Committee has been very small Mike A: Are there guidelines for facilitiating? This would help me and probably others to feel ready to do it.
Joanne: I will show you the blue book after this meeting.
Joanne: Is discouraging and disturbing to have only 10 people show up. And it's mostly the same 10 people more or less every meeting with some exceptions. How do we increase attendance? We need to empower committees.
People need to prioritize when there is an ACM and plan around it. How many people even write it in their calendars?
Laraine: I skip my favorite dance class once a month to come to ACM. I like to come to ACMs and feel movement. Follow up is important. I second that we need to empower committees.
Heather: We accomplished alot today. We also moved through a conflict at the beginning. Which is part of consensus decicion making.
Isabella: Today we used the format, "Who will do what by when," and this is a very effective tool that we should continue to use in task-oriented ACMs.
Heather: We also need to keep using progress reports.
Mike A.: Sometimes when making decisions at ACMS we lack info/ideas. We can use email to share ideas, put out thoughts and ideas on issues.
Heather: If you do that it helps to put in the subject line: 'discussion items for ACM'. Also if you want a response it is good to ask for one.
George: It is important that we make decisions at every ACM. If we do this, as we did today, people will want to be involved. The importance of making decisions at every ACM should be considered when the agenda is planned.
Mike W.: I have been serving on Management and we sign checks at every meeting so money is on my mind.
Things are different now from how they used to be - there is less physical participation in meetings - but I do not feel that the community is falling apart. ACM attendance is not the only barometer for how well the c'ty is doing. I think we are doing well as a community. However, things have changed.
We are hiring out more jobs and our fees are increasing as a result.
It is important to acknowledge the connection there.
Another option that might be more fair would be, instead of increasing fees across the board, have a participation option. I know this has been discussed at previous ACMs and has died in subcommittee. I used to be against this idea because not everyone has the same amount of money. However, I feel now that it is an important option to consider.
Heather: This will be Item #4 in STORAGE BIN. $ for participation.
Laraine: Many people have outside involvements/priorities. Maybe some people move in because co-housing seems cool but they are actually unable to make the time commitment.
Every project I have put energy into has fizzled including the community dance which had 10 people last time. Also, people have volunteered to help and not followed through.
Heather: Ebb and flow of community. Valentines Dance also was not as big as we had hoped. Often we wait until a project is dying to acknowledge the effort and energy of the people who made it happen. It is important to acknowledge time and energy people ARE putting in on a regular basis.
Mike A: As per Mike W's idea, we could start with ACM attendance and charge money to people who do not attend. This is easier to keep track of than other types of participation and a good place to start.
By the next ACM process will provide a formal proposal for the idea of going to one ACM per month, with pros and cons, etc.
If I have misrepresented anyone or left anyone's comments out, please amend.
Isabella
Vicky: Seed exchange this Saturday 2-26-08 starting at 7 pm.
Isabella: Community dance this Friday 2-25-08 at 7:30 pm in CH. Suggested donation. It is a lot of fun, come join us, there will be live music and it is for all ages.
Mike P.: Henry's band Illegal Beagle is playing at the old Mexican market called The Outer Rim (just north on Redwood Road) Friday at 7 pm.
Vicky: All community winter outing on 2-18-08 (Presidents Day/Monday). A day of tubing at Jeremy Ranch. Kids sponsored by Parents Committee. Adults pay own fee.
Heather: Valentines dance fundraiser on 2-15-08 with salsa lesson from 6-7 (hour before). Donation suggested for singles/little less for couples. Dance starts at 8pm.
Mike P.: I am passing around the official paperwork that is necessary to show attendance for an annual meeting. Please sign both copies.
Sign up sheet for committees in CH on wall between kitchen and laundry room . Please sign up for at least one and not more than three. Remember this means that you are committing to this committee for the next year (2008). Sign up sheet will remain in CH for the next week and then Amy H. will make a permanent chart.
Nancy: I would like the square footage of each unit available with the budget, I mentioned this at the last ACM.
Mike P.: Every household should have an appendix of the square footage. There might be an extra one available in CH.
Naomi: I feel we have been spending a lot of money on water and wish to reduce this. I would like a commitment made. The problem seems to be in over watering the lawns and I'd like to have some acknowledgment of that and a commitment to reducing it.
Hans: The water issue has been in management for some time now. For instance the lawn is lumpy in places and we have plans to fix this in spring. Other issues are that the sprinklers on Cheyenne street are sometimes on and we do not know who is turning them on and we are watching them and trying to fix them. Water is a precious issue and we all need to be aware and keep working on it steadily.
Isabella: I agree that this is an important issue that needs to be discussed.
Heather: It is in the storage bin.
Nancy: When does the budget increase go in to affect?
Linda: January 1st.
Vicky: I want to pass this budget otherwise we will be back here next Saturday. I'd rather pass it tonight and it will give us more time. I think this is a great budget and I say we go for it.
Kay: My attitude is that I would like to get the budget out of the way. Someone said the motivation for reducing the water is our values not our budget. If we leave the number as it is than that gives us a carrot for something else, as opposed to we reduce the money because we have to and it is a stick instead of a carrot.
Mike P.: We can cut the numbers all we want but the community is going to do what they are going to do. If this is a priority make sure the people involved in water usage are aware.
Naomi: The budget is our goal for what we are spending and it should be intended . It is not a loose number.
Consensus on budget: Thumbs up. No stand asides. Budget approved.
Welcome new management members. Kay, Hans and Anne. Linda R. is crown rep/bookkeeper. Steve H. is renters rep. and Mike P. and Mike W. will continue.
Storage Bin: Uninvited Guests, Changing Locks, Dining Club/Committee
Hans: If anyone is available to be on a late night group who goes together to check CH for safety please let me know and I will add you to the list.
Mary: A less expensive solution would be to change the locks on the two guestrooms. This would provide that the guest rooms are not used randomly and prevent unauthorized guests in the rooms. Another option is to use a key-less system to enter, it is extremely expensive but has the ability to allow us to lock out someone if needed. It also allows us to see the time the key is used and when the CH is entered.
Linda R.: I would like to suggest that this is safety/security committee work.
Isabella: Another way to approach this is a confrontation (sit down). I volunteer to assist with this.
Nancy: I really like the idea of keys for the rooms. If we had somebody manage the guest rooms they would need use of that key as well. This is a much more fiscally appropriate option.
Hans: Our system with the guest room has been pretty loose and worked well. The issue here is separate from the guest rooms and I would like to propose a little bit of checking up at night to make things easier. I would not allocate a lot of resources to fix something that does not really need to be fixed.
Mary: We have nothing in our rules or regulations saying our hours.
Isabella: There have been a lot of good suggestions.
Naomi: Seems to me like putting a lock is a good idea.
Laraine: It is so hard to get committees to exist and one person to manage such a thing is pretty tricky.
Mike P.: We stayed at another co-housing in Berkley and they had one person who is in charge of this and it worked well for them. If we could find that one person to commit to this it would be nice. I like Hans idea of a night owl group checking on things. If that does not work then one key for just those two rooms seems like a simple way of doing things. In management we looked at the cost and re-keying the whole CH was just under $300.00 and key-less entry is really expensive.
Linda: We have a situation where one individual is abusing this and I think it is absurd to lock everyone else out. I would strongly object to this. There are many reasons we might want to use these rooms without having to make special arrangements to use the rooms. Let's deal with the issue and not make another set of issues.
Nancy: As far as the use of the guest room goes we have had some mix ups with people signing up, canceling or double scheduling. We would have the key not so much to lock people out but to manage the use of those rooms. This is just a thought, I hear what Linda is saying. I volunteer to be the key person and to be a part of the late night team with Hans.
Heather: There are a couple of different issues here. One is confrontation and I think that we are not powerless. We have every right to manage the use of this space and to make sure no one is abusing it . We have never acknowledged what Linda has gone through with her car. I want to bring this out. There are ways we need to take care of each other and I think there is a necessity to have this conversation. We should give the key issue back to management. I hear a lot of people saying what they would like to see but someone needs to do it.
Laraine: I really resonated with what Linda said and just the practicality of it. Your offer is generous Nancy but what happens when you go out of town? There are lots of logistics that need to be managed. It makes things complicated. Our values and what we agreed to need to be addressed. I am very much for a confrontation.
Mary: This community does not have a guideline that I can just point to which explains use of CH.
Heather: We actually can point to some transgressions. We do have guidelines in place already.
Mary: To me it is all very vague.
Mike P.: Parents committee has made CH guidelines before. If someone is not a resident than they have no right to use the CH or be in here at all.
Heather: I would like those interested in confronting the individual and those who are interested in the late night group to meet together and decide how they are going to approach this.
Amy H.: Spider is deathly allergic to peanuts and tree nuts. We always carry a pack with us containing benadryl and an Epipen.
If Spider has hives he needs benadryl ASAP. If allergy symptoms persist his eyes shut up, lips puff up and he grabs his throat. He would then need an Epipen injected into his outer thigh which is meant to be used through clothing. Take the cap off, jab it into thigh and hold him for at least 30 seconds for it to release fully. Next call 911.
Spider is very sensitive about this topic. Please don't talk to him about it or talk about it in front of him. Please help us to make his life as normal as possible and do not give him any kind of food without checking with his parents first. Thank you.
Can we agree to have the CH a nut free zone for the safety of Spider. Thumbs up. All in agreement. Yes. Amy H. will put a photo of Spider along with instructions and Epipen in CH.
Mary advises that the sliding door near kids room and upstairs one should be closed every night in case there is a fire, it would prevent flames from spreading. This was advised by the fire chief when CH was first inspected.
-Laraine will be starting a dance/movement improv. group on Thursday nights 730 to 9pm
-Naomi found a "Non-poisonous, eco-friendly" aunt killer spray at ACE Hardware
-Joanne-only use 1/4 c. of the de-icer on 1 square yard. a little goes a long way.
CH Furnishings Newwasher is installed
Landscape (Mary I didn't catch what you reported before I started taking notes)
Management is now meeting on the 1st and 3rd Wednesday at 7pm. Kay is president and Mike W. Treasurer. They discussed changing locks and came up with the idea of changing keys for the front door, mail room doors and laundry door, with the rest of the CH doors not being keyed at all, but able to be locked on the inside so they will never need to be re-keyed.
Process Joanne is no longer on Process Committee. Amy H., Heather and Laraine now comprise this committee. Please sign up for notetaker and facilitating
Please sign up for committees on large sign up sheet in ch hall.
Water budget has been increased this year which has caused much concern about $ and water conservation. There are possible conflicts between our core values of Aesthetics and Sustainability that may need to be resolved by negotiation, compromise and creative problem solving for the greater good of the community
The reality is that we live in a desert where water is becoming more and more scarce. Disputes are erupting over water rights (underground water table is being diverted from Utah supply to water lawns in Vegas, etc. There was a unanimous agreement that we need to conserve water and live in harmony with our current eco system as our core value of Sustainability suggests. However this means that we may have to compromise some of our aesthetic values and accept a less green CH lawn or tolerate the appearance of water barrels. (Incidentally, it was reported that the usual aeration of the CH lawn was suspended this year due to the lawn being too damp for such a procedure.)
We brainstormed the following ideas re: water conservation. [Rearranged for clarity.] Please be in attendance at our next acm on Wed. 2/27 where we can vote on implementing some or all of the following suggestions.
Lawn
Drip
Water Collection
Garden
Awareness
On Feb 9, 2008, at 9:26 PM, Joanne Lovejoy wrote:
Thanks for getting the notes out Laraine. I also announced the Emergency Preparedness check list and left copies in the mail room.
Thanks, Joanne
From: Laraine Miner
Thanks y'all for the corrections. apologies for the oversights.
I should mention that it would be nice if folks would consider these water conservation suggestions and even have some internet dialogue on them so we can make some well-informed, well considered decisions next ACM.
Laraine
From: WaCoHo on behalf of Mike Angelastro \Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 9:32 PM
To: Wasatch Commons Cohousing Members
Subject: Re: [WaCoHo] Today's ACM Notes
Attachments: [WaCoHo] Today's ACM Notes (498 bytes)
I don't know much about the larger watering picture (orchard, garden etc.) but I'm glad you used words like "may" and "possible" as I do not believe we have all the facts yet about the impact that the Common House lawn may have had on the water budget. (I've been saying for months that there is an underground leak in the system that feeds the Common House lawn and that if it were fixed we would have much less of a problem.)
In addition there is an overlap in part of the system that requires one area to be over watered in order to adequately water the other. Also, some areas don't have enough sprinkler heads, exacerbating the situation. If these problems were fixed, we could be much more frugal in our water use and still have a green lawn.
I am more than willing to continue to be one of the water "masters," but we need to have a more formal "report back" process in place so that more community members are aware of what the real problems are so that good decisions can be made.
Here are the notes. Apologize in advance for errors or omissions. Please post corrections to all. I fly out of town again tomorrow (Sunday morning).
Thanks, Michelle
Community Dance Jan 25 7:30-10. * Jobs for Justice Winter Conference Jan 8&9 U of U, Linda P will post flyer with more info
Utah Solar Assoc. Information Meeting Jan 15th, 7pm Salt Lake Community College Meadowbrook campus. Heralding an upcoming course on Solar energy and installation. Flyer in lobby.
Security discussion: (Occurred initially in Announcements and again then at the end of the meeting.)
Appears someone has been staying in the common house without member sponsorship and no record on calendar. Heat has been found turned way up to 80 degrees and sofas, and guest room look used. Members of the group will keep close watch these next couple of weeks, and pair up to go check things out in the early morning hours and call police if any unauthorized people are found on premises. Need further discussion of this issue at future ACM.
Decision was made to leave the lights on the side of the common house, but not on Cheyenne Street based on prior request from neighbor.
Lynda A resigned, Heather and Amy H. will lead the committee. They are planning an adult (21+) dance to raise money for Common House- especially furniture. Hope to have salsa lesson prior to dance. Looking for volunteers to help.
Amy H. has joined. New box for suggestions or agenda/discussion items is located on inside mail room.
Exciting new projects coming up this year. Organizing community service mornings to help keep our Garden of Eden beautiful.
Common House:
New washer purchased will arrive next week. Glasses replaced in December, will finish up with silverware.
Will be picking up the mandate work that began last year. *
Looking to organize outside activity for children. Soliciting suggestions.
Vaughn: Management looked for way to not pass on such a large increase. Want to keep the community moving by continuing to allow the committees to have and spend their budget. Most of the expenses that management has control over are fixed.
Since some of the committees have not been as active as in the past, management's role is expanding to step into the oversite of some of the projects/repairs that arise. This also has implications for future financial expenditures as we find ourselves needed to hire services that in the past may have been handled by community members.
Discussion regarding the relatively low condo fees we have here even with the increase.
Discussion regarding past increases- last year it was a 6 % increase. For many years (maybe 4) we didn't have any increases. (Later mentioned that previously there were funds left over from construction that were used to cover some expenses. Those funds no longer exist.)
Clarity regarding money put aside from this budget $12,480 to capital reserve fund. This based on previous discussions regarding the need to build up the fund for future expenses to avoid large assessments. Linda R. deposits check each month into this fund.
Hans- Our fees are low, now is time to focus on some necessary projects- covers for rain gutters, trimming trees that pose hazard, plan for new trees for our future. He wants to approve this increase and plan for another 10 % next year.
Naomi- Resist hiring projects out, wants to encourage participation and not have a full 10% increase. She would like to pay for some things like gutter cleaning.
Mary- We have discussed cash budget versus time budget, we still don't know what the real time budget to maintain this place. If we don't spend the money on maintenance, then we will spend it in more costly repairs later on. In response to Naomi gutter cleaning- we did it once- cost $3,000. It needs to be done twice a year, that would mean $6,000 or $300 per house per year if we paid for it.
Amy- Would like management to consider determining a fixed increase so that families could prepare in advance for future increases.
Linda R. We can do that at any time. We would need to put that on future agenda.
Hans- I would like to support Hobb's suggestion for local currency to pay for things that need doing.
Hobb- The idea is to have Wasatch Bucks as a way to barter our services with one another.
Isabella- Why increase in landscaping?
Mary/Hobb- Mainly for the trimming of dangerous tree limbs.
From: WaCoHo on behalf of Michelle Frandsen\Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 2:27 PM
Subject: [WaCoHo] Opps
I realized that I left out the conversation regarding adding each unit's square footage to the sheet listing the budget increase. Sorry! Michelle
From: WaCoHo on behalf of Michelle Frandsen\Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 10:26 PM To:
Subject: [WaCoHo] Addition to notes & CH request
Things keep coming to my mind that didn't make it into my notes..... For storage bin: We had a discussion around some sort of laminated sign that could be posted when we are hosting a guest in the common house, and perhaps write on the white board also who is hosting the guest. We didn't come to conclusion but asked that it be brought up again at another meeting.
Also when I was giving the bathrooms a quick once over before I leave, I noticed we don't have any extra toilet paper on hand. Is any one going to Costco or the like who could pick up a new batch? If not I can do that when I get back into town later this week, but we may run out before then....
Michelle
April 25, 2020